The Top 100 BDSM / Fetish Books    [other banners]

	TSR : Web boards : M/s D/s O&P : "Learning curve" 1 2 Learning curve (12) This post is on the M/s D/s O&P web board. Thu 10 Aug 06, 9:04 PM His_devada US, 5 yrs I was hoping I could once again trouble some of the "experts"--especially Masters/Mistresses or Dom(me)s for some advice. I am certain that I have made a terrible mistake--and while I am confident that after a sufficient punishment consisting of absolute ignoring; my Master and I will manage to move forward, but I am trying to figure out how to prevent it from happening again. My Master's previous relationship; while BDSM in nature--NOT D/s, lasted over 4 years. They lived together, considered themselves "married" and I know that when the relationship ended Master's poor heart was broken--in fact he was very apprehensive and sometimes still is about getting in "too deep" with another woman. My hope is that this is why my being a devoted sub will be good for him...he will be able to feel like the center of the universe, even if it is only mine. The problem is that there are still pictures of her/them EVERYWHERE in his house (I don't live there--but spend a fair amount of time there) and he has all but refused to ever take them down. What's more...is after 22 months he hasn't put any up of me/us. He says that it is just "part of the decor"--and to a certain extent I believe him, she probably put them up when she lived there. But it is getting increasingly difficult, especially in the past 9 months as our relationship moved from "casual" to "serious" and in the past 4 months as it evolved (and continues to evolve) into D/s. As a sub I know it is not my place to "demand" that he takes her pictures down--I really don't even care if he takes them down, just putting up one or two of mine would be nice. I even framed a few and gave them to him as a gift--they are sitting on a shelf in his closet with socks and paperwork on top of them. Well, twice in the past two weeks I have forced the issue, last Saturday I pushed it too far and now he has refused to speak to me for 5 days. When I brought it up (I admit, humbly, in a smart-ass, snooty, immature--but out of desperation--way) he unequivocally said that because I have made it an issue now he will do the opposite. Because I should know that if I try to "make" him do something, he WILL do exactly the opposite because I am sub and that is not my place. So, is there a way a sub (I realize that the situation would be different for a slave, respectively) could bring up something that her Master is doing/has done that bothers her or hurts her feelings? Master and I do not fight or argue--hardly ever, because normally whatever he wants is great with me, I want to give him his way. But the few times I have had reasons to truly punished (always by ignoring me for days or weeks) it was because my dominant side crept out and I let my mouth get the best of me, stepping out of my boundaries, being "out of line". But that is because I do not know how to address my needs in a relationship that is completely centered around his. Thanks in advance for your advice. princess4DFD--Master's pleasure is my pleasure XOXO 11 Aug 06, 1:13 AM 631-535-398 US, 6 yrs Y! princess4dfd wrote: I was hoping I could once again trouble some of the "experts"--especially Masters/Mistresses or Dom(me)s for some advice. I am certain that I have made a terrible mistake--and while I am confident that after a sufficient punishment consisting of absolute ignoring; my Master and I will manage to move forward, but I am trying to figure out how to prevent it from happening again. My Master's previous relationship; while BDSM in nature--NOT D/s, lasted over 4 years. They lived together, considered themselves "married" and I know that when the relationship ended Master's poor heart was broken--in fact he was very apprehensive and sometimes still is about getting in "too deep" with another woman. My hope is that this is why my being a devoted sub will be good for him...he will be able to feel like the center of the universe, even if it is only mine. The problem is that there are still pictures of her/them EVERYWHERE in his house (I don't live there--but spend a fair amount of time there) and he has all but refused to ever take them down. What's more...is after 22 months he hasn't put any up of me/us. He says that it is just "part of the decor"--and to a certain extent I believe him, she probably put them up when she lived there. But it is getting increasingly difficult, especially in the past 9 months as our relationship moved from "casual" to "serious" and in the past 4 months as it evolved (and continues to evolve) into D/s. As a sub I know it is not my place to "demand" that he takes her pictures down--I really don't even care if he takes them down, just putting up one or two of mine would be nice. I even framed a few and gave them to him as a gift--they are sitting on a shelf in his closet with socks and paperwork on top of them. Well, twice in the past two weeks I have forced the issue, last Saturday I pushed it too far and now he has refused to speak to me for 5 days. When I brought it up (I admit, humbly, in a smart-ass, snooty, immature--but out of desperation--way) he unequivocally said that because I have made it an issue now he will do the opposite. Because I should know that if I try to "make" him do something, he WILL do exactly the opposite because I am sub and that is not my place. So, is there a way a sub (I realize that the situation would be different for a slave, respectively) could bring up something that her Master is doing/has done that bothers her or hurts her feelings? Master and I do not fight or argue--hardly ever, because normally whatever he wants is great with me, I want to give him his way. But the few times I have had reasons to truly punished (always by ignoring me for days or weeks) it was because my dominant side crept out and I let my mouth get the best of me, stepping out of my boundaries, being "out of line". But that is because I do not know how to address my needs in a relationship that is completely centered around his. Thanks in advance for your advice. princess, i don't have any great suggestions for you except to try to talk to Him, and that apparently isn't working. Just so you know, this slave would have issues with that as well. When you are in an emotional relationship with someone, even if They are your Dom/me They do need to take care with feelings of Their "property" (can't think of a better word to describe everyone). i think you are being reasonable in asking Him to display some of Y/you together (unless Your relationship is a secret from someone who visits Him regularly?). Anyways just a slave's 2 cents. slave giolla 11 Aug 06, 1:28 AM His_devada US, 5 yrs 631-535-398 wrote: princess, i don't have any great suggestions for you except to try to talk to Him, and that apparently isn't working. Just so you know, this slave would have issues with that as well. When you are in an emotional relationship with someone, even if They are your Dom/me They do need to take care with feelings of Their "property" (can't think of a better word to describe everyone). i think you are being reasonable in asking Him to display some of Y/you together (unless Your relationship is a secret from someone who visits Him regularly?). Anyways just a slave's 2 cents. slave giolla yes, I suppose you are right. He has never "promised" to be monogomous--for the first while we were seeing each other I knew for fact that he wasn't (though I am specifically instructed to be--grrr) but once I felt that he was no longer seeing other girls I guess is when I got confident enough to want to cross that next level. I guess maybe I had blinders on--but I am certain that I put them on myself. Hmmm, seeing your words in black and white may have given me some clarity...giving yourself to someone does not guarantee that they will take ownership of you. It breaks my heart to acknowledge that--but it is becoming more and more apparent all the time. Thank you for your kind words. princess4DFD--Master's pleasure is my (heartbreaking) pleasure 11 Aug 06, 5:32 PM slave_emma US(OK), 6 yrs Y! princess4dfd wrote: I was hoping I could once again trouble some of the "experts"--especially Masters/Mistresses or Dom(me)s for some advice. I am certain that I have made a terrible mistake--and while I am confident that after a sufficient punishment consisting of absolute ignoring; my Master and I will manage to move forward, but I am trying to figure out how to prevent it from happening again. My Master's previous relationship; while BDSM in nature--NOT D/s, lasted over 4 years. They lived together, considered themselves "married" and I know that when the relationship ended Master's poor heart was broken--in fact he was very apprehensive and sometimes still is about getting in "too deep" with another woman. My hope is that this is why my being a devoted sub will be good for him...he will be able to feel like the center of the universe, even if it is only mine. The problem is that there are still pictures of her/them EVERYWHERE in his house (I don't live there--but spend a fair amount of time there) and he has all but refused to ever take them down. What's more...is after 22 months he hasn't put any up of me/us. He says that it is just "part of the decor"--and to a certain extent I believe him, she probably put them up when she lived there. But it is getting increasingly difficult, especially in the past 9 months as our relationship moved from "casual" to "serious" and in the past 4 months as it evolved (and continues to evolve) into D/s. As a sub I know it is not my place to "demand" that he takes her pictures down--I really don't even care if he takes them down, just putting up one or two of mine would be nice. I even framed a few and gave them to him as a gift--they are sitting on a shelf in his closet with socks and paperwork on top of them. Well, twice in the past two weeks I have forced the issue, last Saturday I pushed it too far and now he has refused to speak to me for 5 days. When I brought it up (I admit, humbly, in a smart-ass, snooty, immature--but out of desperation--way) he unequivocally said that because I have made it an issue now he will do the opposite. Because I should know that if I try to "make" him do something, he WILL do exactly the opposite because I am sub and that is not my place. So, is there a way a sub (I realize that the situation would be different for a slave, respectively) could bring up something that her Master is doing/has done that bothers her or hurts her feelings? Master and I do not fight or argue--hardly ever, because normally whatever he wants is great with me, I want to give him his way. But the few times I have had reasons to truly punished (always by ignoring me for days or weeks) it was because my dominant side crept out and I let my mouth get the best of me, stepping out of my boundaries, being "out of line". But that is because I do not know how to address my needs in a relationship that is completely centered around his. Thanks in advance for your advice. princess, i understand where you are coming from with wanting your Master to take down the pictures of His ex. i know that sort of thing would really bother me. When i was with my former Master, He had a number of other subs. i was the only live-in at the time. Often times, with my former Master He would not tell me about the other girls and i would just meet them one day and i would get pushed aside for a couple days while He played with them or what not. i am admittedly a jealous person and i can't stand competition. Because W/we had communication issues and a number of other issues (He was abusive). W/we parted ways. Now i look at that time as a learning experience. Master Howard and i have an agreement with other girls (and alot of other things). i know about any other girl and i get to be there during play. i am bi, so that is just an extra perk for me. Since i don't know what your agreement is with your Master, it is hard to say. Does He view you as His slave or just a play partner? i would ask Him if you can have permission to speak freely. If that is granted, politely let Him know how the pictures make you feel. i would ask (because i am a jealous person), if there are any other girls and if He is still seeing His ex. If i had to guess i would say He is still seeing His ex. Most people throw away pictures of their exs asap. Hopefully i am wrong, He could just have those pictures up to remind you of your place as a slave, not a girlfriend. i do hope everything works out with the two of Y/you. best wishes, slave emma Master Howard's little girl 11 Aug 06, 6:32 PM Sluggo55555 US, 6 yrs Y! My two cents; Explain it like this and I mean exactly like this and articulately from a submissive head space. When you do X I feel like X. I am aware that my feelings are my own and you do not have to be responsible for them. Step two; and this is the hard part after you say that, 1 leave it alone, and two understand what his response means and accept the consequences for that. It may mean that he is not ready or willing to be responsible for your feelings which I think is necessary in a D/s dynamic. It may be that he doesn't do what you wanted but that he explains his actions in a way that make his actions make sense to you (his choice). Good luck V 11 Aug 06, 6:32 PM His_devada US, 5 yrs slave_emma wrote: princess, i understand where you are coming from with wanting your Master to take down the pictures of His ex. i know that sort of thing would really bother me. When i was with my former Master, He had a number of other subs. i was the only live-in at the time. Often times, with my former Master He would not tell me about the other girls and i would just meet them one day and i would get pushed aside for a couple days while He played with them or what not. i am admittedly a jealous person and i can't stand competition. Because W/we had communication issues and a number of other issues (He was abusive). W/we parted ways. Now i look at that time as a learning experience. Master Howard and i have an agreement with other girls (and alot of other things). i know about any other girl and i get to be there during play. i am bi, so that is just an extra perk for me. Since i don't know what your agreement is with your Master, it is hard to say. Does He view you as His slave or just a play partner? i would ask Him if you can have permission to speak freely. If that is granted, politely let Him know how the pictures make you feel. i would ask (because i am a jealous person), if there are any other girls and if He is still seeing His ex. If i had to guess i would say He is still seeing His ex. Most people throw away pictures of their exs asap. Hopefully i am wrong, He could just have those pictures up to remind you of your place as a slave, not a girlfriend. i do hope everything works out with the two of Y/you. best wishes, slave emma [/quote] Ah! Yet another interesting twist! I hadn't considered the possibility of the ex-still being around. That is an excellent point. He does actually refer to me as "his girlfriend"--only recently in the past 4 months or so starting "officially" telling his friends that. He has always been the resident "life-long" bachelor in the group. For at least the first year, I was his "plaything" and I knew there were others. So that is why I didn't push the issue about the pictures then. Once he started demonstrating more of a commitment and especially when we "officially" decided that I would be his sub and he would be my Master, I felt it was time to put the pictures away or at least put some of me around. I mean if he can tell all his friends that he "has a girlfriend now" why can't he put the pix up?? They all know about me?? However, I have suspected in the past that either A.) she still was around from time to time (I think she lives across town and I know she recently had a baby..which is why they broke up, he didn't want one, or B.) he feels that she is "the one" that any girls/subs/slaves who come along the way are merely filling a void until she comes "back home". Which may be never but since she broke his heart so much I don't know if he will ever allow himself to really love anyone else. No matter how deeply I love him and surrender my entire being to him. Like with slave giolla's words, as painful for me as it is, seeing someone else's perspective reiterating what deep down I probably already knew and reading it in black and white allows me to open my eyes which have been clouded by a haze of fantasy and submission and see things for what they (most likely) are. I more than anyone, hope we are all wrong. But...if it walks like a duck and looks like a duck... thank you. I find my strength in slaves like (all of) you. Especially when I see that now that I have decided that this is the life for me--I can find a Master who will love and treasure me as his property. Right now I desperately hope it turns out to be him, but if not I know he is out there...somewhere. princess4DFD (with a heavy heart) Master's pleasure is my tearful pleasure~~ 11 Aug 06, 8:45 PM submissiveheart US(NY), 6 yrs My advice (boy do I relate to you) is to see yourself as valuable. You come across in your posts as intelligent, articulate and passionate. You're motivated. I don't know much about you but these are the things I pick up on. Sure you probably have your issue as we all do. But when we strive for something so hard without a reciprocal effort on the other end there is a message we send that we aren't valuable. Even the most self-aware person can fall into the trap of taking someone for granted when they always make a huge effort. Yes, what was said before by others could be true (giolla's comment about your pic...? Hmm..). Bottom line is you don't know though and remember that. I think Sluggo's advice to ask him and then basically step back and stay quiet is GREAT advice. Also observe. Actions speak louder than words...but words express the conscious choice. If you watch only actions (I made this mistake) you may see great care but still the head has to agree with the heart,no? Anyway, I've know we've memoed about this (and technically I'm cheating on my dissertation--30 lashes to me) but I couldn't resist. I'd hate you to make some of the same mistakes I did. Not that I regret any time with Sir. I don't at all. He's kind and wonderful (wonderful loving him). He and I cleared out much confusion over the summer (still hurts tho'). 23 Aug 06, 6:11 AM His_devada US, 5 yrs Sluggo55555 wrote: My two cents; Explain it like this and I mean exactly like this and articulately from a submissive head space. When you do X I feel like X. I am aware that my feelings are my own and you do not have to be responsible for them. Step two; and this is the hard part after you say that, 1 leave it alone, and two understand what his response means and accept the consequences for that. It may mean that he is not ready or willing to be responsible for your feelings which I think is necessary in a D/s dynamic. It may be that he doesn't do what you wanted but that he explains his actions in a way that make his actions make sense to you (his choice). Good luck V well, I hate to be so selfish in involving everyone in my drama but you all helped me SO much I just had to post an update! I actually took a little out of each post in this thread and wanted to say Thanks!! Two week silent treatment was up yesterday--Master and I talked about why this had become such an issue. I was very respectful and said exactly what Sluggo told me to; with a little emma, submissiveheart and giolla mixed in...that it is not her pictures that bother me as I understand that she was a big part of his life and he did have a life before me afterall--but that I feel that if he isn't willing to put mine up he is either ashamed of me, still seeing other girls, or just demonstrating his power in his domain (it IS his house afterall). I told him that I still love him and worship him and wish to belong to him for as long as I am able to but that I was just very hurt and didn't know how to bring it up and that I understand that how I did it (sarcastically, disrespectfully and rude) was not right and I am deeply sorry for that. He said that he doesn't like to see me so sad and hates to be the one to make me that way--that part of it was him seeing my persistence as demanding and as being dominating and as much as it hurt him to have to punish me with silent treatment it was necessary, but also a part of it was in fact that he (like Sluggo said) just didn't feel ready to acknowledge or admit his feelings for me by putting my pictures up (but during the past two weeks has realized he IS ready to admit those feelings now) and part of it was simply laziness that he really just hasn't gotten around to it--but he realizes it is important to me so he promises that he will. Not tomorrow, but when it is time so I will need to demonstrate some patience. I asked him the same question I asked you all...how should I bring something up in the future if it is bothering me. He said, just like Sluggo and emma suggested that I should ask for permission to speak freely and then calmly and articulately explain my concerns and if his response doesn't answer my question...I may try to re-word it more clearly and ask again but I will accept it as final. I am really going to try to work on that. I believe that he really wants me to be "his" but he sees my ability to be a smart-ass and sarcastic when I am unhappy as Domme behavior and that is what broke up all of his past relationships. When those girls tried to control him...which I have promised never to try to do. I think it will take actually doing it a few times...truly trial by fire; but I am willing to do whatever it takes. I also must now wait a little longer for the pictures to come down because if he were to do it right away it would be him giving in to my tantrum which would be rewarding me for my bad behavior--I understand that now. But I am now confident that it will come...I just must be patient. He reassured me that he does love me, there's no other girls, he does treasure me, and most of all...he does value me. That is enough for me...I will now wait patiently knowing that that is what he has instructed me to do and that my reward will come from demonstrating my devotion. One other good thing is (I briefly talked about this in another thread) that he has come up with some ideas of some discipline techniques to help me remember that I am sub he is Master. That is actually music to my ears because I think the times when I forget my place and get dominative is when, as someone said in another thread, my Master isn't Mastering me. So I am quite happy that he still wants me to serve him...because that is all I could ever hope for. Thanks for all Y/your help E/everyone!! princess4DFD--Master's pleasure is my pleasure XOXO Edited 13 Oct 06, 11:28 PM by His_devada 23 Aug 06, 7:39 AM 631-535-398 US, 6 yrs Y! princess4dfd wrote: *severe snipping* So I am quite happy that he still wants me to serve him...because that is all I could ever hope for. Thanks for all Y/your help E/everyone!! Princes4dfd you are more than welcome. Thank you very much for the update, and i am so glad that it turned out well. Sounds like He sorta needed that time to get His head straight around some things as well. my Master is a big believer in that everything that happens has a reason it happened. Maybe this was needed to bring you closer together. Again thanks for letting me/U/us know what happened. slave giolla 23 Aug 06, 10:52 AM submissiveheart US(NY), 6 yrs I have to say that I'm very happy for you. It's important to see things clearly and without the rose-colored glasses (tough to do when in love as you obviously are) yet it is important to feel and trust. You have communicated honestly and it sounds like he has too. I'd believe him unless he gives you reason to doubt. No sense mind-tripping. So it would go far I think to step back in your love... Love shows itself in many many ways and with someone as obviously committment shy as him it is best to remember to let him set the emotional pace. Edited 25 Aug 06, 6:39 AM by submissiveheart 24 Sep 07, 10:29 PM His_devada US, 5 yrs His_devada wrote: He said that he doesn't like to see me so sad and hates to be the one to make me that way--that part of it was him seeing my persistence as demanding and as being dominating and as much as it hurt him to have to punish me with silent treatment it was necessary, --but he realizes it is important to me so he promises that he will. Not tomorrow, but when it is time so I will need to demonstrate some patience. Just looking at some old posts...to see how/if I've grown over the past year. I couldn't believe that this one was from a YEAR ago--because FINALLY last week, I was cooking dinner and going about my business when out of the blue he said, "I want you to go ahead and replace the pictures in the house that have (her) in them. You may not throw anything away--put them in a pile and I will decide what to do with them. But you can just take the old pictures out of the frames and put in any that you want. Okay?" Talk about a lesson in patience! I mean when he told me that "it would happen, not tomorrow but when it is time" I had to believe him...and not push it again...and really just wait until it was indeed time. This is one example how a Master can test you...and will wait it out almost to the point of torture just to teach you a lesson. I guess I passed but it wasn't easy. Of course most things that are worth it generally aren't. His~devada (formerly)~~princess4dfd~~ Anyone can say "I'd die for you" because it is rarely tested, but I can honestly say that I live for you...and will prove it every day. Next page