This page sponsored by Madame S, San Francisco    [other banners]

	TSR : Web boards : M/s D/s O&P : "Dominant Slaves" 1 2 Dominant Slaves (18) This post is on the M/s D/s O&P web board. 26 Jan 12, 11:08 PM Mistress_Rebekah CA, 10 mths Y! Ceilyn wrote: is that article anywhere else? I'm hitting a 404 on the links. http://www.teramis.com/kink/nature_of_opr.htm I had a close bracket at the end of the link, which should not have been there. This should work. M. Rebekah 27 Jan 12, 1:00 AM Dagobert US(WA), 21 mths I have gone on the record here at TSR as saying that a slave has a certain power in their submission. While I don't believe a "true"* slave can be dominant with regard to its owner, I do believe that the act of being a slave takes a certain strength and power that comes close to dominance. * -- I put it in quotes, people, specifically to keep a flame war about "what is a true slave?" at bay. 27 Jan 12, 1:20 AM slave_torianna US(GA), 15 mths Am I dominant/have dominant traits? ...Well yes and no, it depends. At work, I am dominant. I will not be 'used' or treated lesser than another, I will not stand for it. At home, or anywhere with Daddy...all dominant traits seem to just naturally disappear. I respect and fear Him, I recognize myself as the inferior. I have never pulled the 'i have rights' card and I dont want to imagine how that coversation would end lol I do think I have the right to safety, thats really the only thing I can think that I MIGHT be entitled to but really idk if I even believe that bc I feel Daddy has the right to choose my quality of life. Thanks for starting the thread...very interesting!! slave torianna i dont walk in front or beside Daddy, i walk a step behind in my place, but close enough to grab His shirt tail if i ever get scared. i'm thankful to my Master that never leaves me behind. Thank you for loving someone like me Daddy. 27 Jan 12, 4:18 AM 299-529-487 US(PA), 5 mths Y! slave_emma wrote: I would say that on a daily basis I am pretty much self-directed on what to do, not because I am dominant but because I know what my Master expects of me. He likes anticipatory service. I never looked at as a way of gaining dominance in the household. I looked at it as a way I was adding value and service to the household. Moving on, I have never pulled the “I have rights” card to get out of doing something for my Master. To me, that just does not sound like something that would regularly creep up in a healthy relationship. As far as a slave having rights, I would say a slave does have rights as a member of the human race. Just like a dog or cat has the right not to be abused or mistreated. Lastly, I do not consider my enslavement to my Master to be erotic. It is part of my everyday life and I am not in a constant state of sexual arousal. His control goes beyond the bedroom. I do not think I would be truly happy with just a kink relationship. I would be missing the guidance from my Master, the fulfillment I get from serving him, and etc. ___________________________________________________ ______ Emma.. i so very much enjoy your posts. i just had this conversation with someone. my service to Owner is based on the "every day stuff" and i take great pleasure in knowing He is pleased with me and trusts my decision making on matters as they pertain to O/our and my career. Thank you for your eloquence. *~FCL's boo~* 28 Jan 12, 2:24 PM pet_ka_MJ CA, 2 yrs Mistress_Rebekah wrote: So... for the slaves... would you typically describe yourselves as dominant and/or having dominant traits? Do you consider effectively serving your Owner/Master/Mistress to be something that requires "self-directed take-charge-ness"? Dominant... all the way. My Master does not allow me to apologize for it anymore either. Mistress_Rebekah wrote: Do any of the slaves here have rights or believe they have entitlements? If so, what are they? Has this sort of conversation ever cropped up (i.e. have any slaves ever tried to defy their Owner/Master/Mistress using the "I have rights" argument)? Whether we want to acknowledge it or not... we all have rights. They are a by-product of the society we live in. The question then becomes whether we, as participants of this lifestyle, choose to exercise them or not. I find it rather amusing that the very rights that allow us to pursue this lifestyle to some degree are the ones we so vehemently deny in slaves... freedom of expression, self determination. Mistress_Rebekah wrote: And, for anyone who wishes to comment, what do you think of the statement: "Many, many people are involved in D/s of various degrees of control, using the terms “Master”, “Mistress” and “slave” for the erotic charge and symbolic meaning of it. Relatively few people engage in an M/s relationship in its original and traditional sense of owning obedient human property, using the words “Master” and “slave” in their literal sense... A lot of people like to use the word “slave” because it has erotic juice, and that is where a lot of confusion comes in: as if there were different styles of “Master/slave” relationships. In my analysis, there are no different styles of M/s relationships if we are talking about the essential Owner/property agreement... I also recognize that, as happens with language, the terms slave and M/s have been absorbed wholesale into the broader kink community and are often used with little or no understanding of or regard for the current or older meanings of those words. I think this happens from ignorance." Language changes as society changes. Mailman becomes letter carrier, fireman become firefighter. Why do we in this lifestyle assume the language we use to define ourselves and the meanings assigned those words are immune? This lifestyle has co-opted the words Master and slave to reflect OUR concept of human ownership... a deviation from the original, intended use of the words I am sure. This lifestyle is evolving as a result of the internet. The changes are creating a generation gap with the old hanging on for dear life to what they know and the new finding their place. It is a battle this lifestyle is not going to win... did our parents or grandparents have anymore luck imposing their generation's values, beliefs and labels on us? I don't think so. For me, this argument over lifestyle labels is similar to the debate over fundamentalist religious beliefs versus liberal religious beliefs. I do not think we are any further ahead or enlightened in our lifestyle... in fact I can see the "armed camps" digging in for a fight. It's an argument that can't be won. Mistress_Rebekah wrote: The "erotic juice" part struck me as... well, I'll leave other's to comment on that one It struck me as a rather narrow and confining focus for living one's life. Actually, I can see it becoming rather boring. "We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned, so as to have the life that is waiting for us. The old skin must be shed before a new one can come." ~ Joseph Campbell Edited 28 Jan 12, 2:26 PM by pet_ka_MJ 28 Jan 12, 4:36 PM 000-772-096 US, 7 yrs I was not aware that the terms slave and dominant were mutually exclusive. I don't think a submissive personality is a requirement for being a slave and I don't think a dominant personality is a requirement to own another person. Perhaps that is what other people require in order to define themselves or others, but I do not so that doesn't apply in my world. There are certainly any number of potential combinations of personality and orientation. I do not understand the concept of pulling a card for rights or entitlement. That makes no sense to me so I'll stay away from it. I do not understand the concept of people insisting that rights can or cannot be denied because I don't believe in the way it is generally expressed so therefore I don't have to worry my pretty little head about it. What other people require to function on a daily basis is none of my concern. I don't see using the terms Master or slave as being some type of an erotic juice either, but then again perhaps I am just unusually dense. (I'm not certain I even know what that means although I felt the author was very condescending about the use of such terms and hope that I am mistaken but fear that I am not) I would certainly use the term Master or slave over something that ***TO ME** is nothing more than another type of identifier like husband or girlfriend. Neither of those terms hold any greater significance to me than using "woman" "man" "child" or "insertallotherwordstodescribepeople" nor do I hold any greater "respect" or "deference" to any person who uses any type of descriptor than I do to a person who does not use them so freely. I am unable to process any general descriptor as "erotic juice" only, but perhaps that is just me again. (And I am so thankful for that) **reminder of the pesky disclaimer, no animals were harmed in the forming of these thoughts that are not a representation of any other person and god forbid anyone take offence at being told they don't have to live in my world with my thoughts that are only mine and not meant to suggest otherwise. It's a real pity when one has to provide a disclaimer for the freaking disclaimer. I use the terms Master(male) & slave(female) because that is who we are. Insert all possible disclaimers - my thoughts, my opinions, my experiences, my words. Your mileage should vary. I'm one of "those people." Above all - I believe in Master. I find it's hard to stumble when you are on your knees. Edited 28 Jan 12, 4:39 PM by 000-772-096 28 Jan 12, 10:12 PM mastersgirl3 US, 5 mths Mistress_Rebekah wrote: Dominant Slaves So... for the slaves... would you typically describe yourselves as dominant and/or having dominant traits? Do you consider effectively serving your Owner/Master/Mistress to be something that requires "self-directed take-charge-ness"? Also, another statement that struck me as interesting was: “a slave has no rights” is equivalent to saying, “the slave must at all times be obedient, even if the Master's orders oppose something the slave thinks s/he is entitled to”. Do any of the slaves here have rights or believe they have entitlements? If so, what are they? Has this sort of conversation ever cropped up (i.e. have any slaves ever tried to defy their Owner/Master/Mistress using the "I have rights" argument)? And, for anyone who wishes to comment, what do you think of the statement: "Many, many people are involved in D/s of various degrees of control, using the terms “Master”, “Mistress” and “slave” for the erotic charge and symbolic meaning of it. Relatively few people engage in an M/s relationship in its original and traditional sense of owning obedient human property, using the words “Master” and “slave” in their literal sense... A lot of people like to use the word “slave” because it has erotic juice, and that is where a lot of confusion comes in: as if there were different styles of “Master/slave” relationships. In my analysis, there are no different styles of M/s relationships if we are talking about the essential Owner/property agreement... I also recognize that, as happens with language, the terms slave and M/s have been absorbed wholesale into the broader kink community and are often used with little or no understanding of or regard for the current or older meanings of those words. I think this happens from ignorance" Cheers, M. Rebekah - i do have dominant traits and i feel they get in the way of serving my Master. - i do have rights. i am a full participant in raising our children. When it comes to them my feelings and actions stand not as a slave but as a mother and NO ONE not even my Master could take this away and we did have that argument once. Another right is to take care of my self medically. i do as i see fit in this aspect. i know i have other rights, but those are the ones that come to mind. -Wow, those are powerful statements. i guess yes, i bet that is true for some couples where they "play" a M/s relationship, but for me when my Master calls me slave it doesn't get "erotic juices" going it makes me feel loved, owned, and controlled. Yes, we have sex... We are married. i feel like the sex portion is small piece of our M/s relationship. For me it is about serving my Master and doing what i can to make him happy. 29 Jan 12, 1:51 AM Mistress_Rebekah CA, 10 mths Y! 000-772-096 wrote: I was not aware that the terms slave and dominant were mutually exclusive. I don't think a submissive personality is a requirement for being a slave and I don't think a dominant personality is a requirement to own another person. Perhaps that is what other people require in order to define themselves or others, but I do not so that doesn't apply in my world. There are certainly any number of potential combinations of personality and orientation. I do not understand the concept of pulling a card for rights or entitlement. That makes no sense to me so I'll stay away from it. I do not understand the concept of people insisting that rights can or cannot be denied because I don't believe in the way it is generally expressed so therefore I don't have to worry my pretty little head about it. What other people require to function on a daily basis is none of my concern. I don't see using the terms Master or slave as being some type of an erotic juice either, but then again perhaps I am just unusually dense. (I'm not certain I even know what that means although I felt the author was very condescending about the use of such terms and hope that I am mistaken but fear that I am not) I would certainly use the term Master or slave over something that ***TO ME** is nothing more than another type of identifier like husband or girlfriend. Neither of those terms hold any greater significance to me than using "woman" "man" "child" or "insertallotherwordstodescribepeople" nor do I hold any greater "respect" or "deference" to any person who uses any type of descriptor than I do to a person who does not use them so freely. I am unable to process any general descriptor as "erotic juice" only, but perhaps that is just me again. (And I am so thankful for that) **reminder of the pesky disclaimer, no animals were harmed in the forming of these thoughts that are not a representation of any other person and god forbid anyone take offence at being told they don't have to live in my world with my thoughts that are only mine and not meant to suggest otherwise. It's a real pity when one has to provide a disclaimer for the freaking disclaimer. 096, I always love reading your thoughts and ideas about things but I do wish you would stop worrying so much about your disclaimers. Mature, intelligent people will read and understand your posts for what they are: your opinion. The others who are either too stupid, ignorant or rude don't matter and you shouldn't feel you have to explain or excuse your explanations and opinions. But... that's just my opinion As for your reply, I agree... I believe people from all walks of life with various personality traits and characteristics enter these lifestyles... they do so for many personal reasons. My sub is submissive to me, but he is certainly not submissive to others. He has an extremely dominant personality overall, but with me he does not. I don't believe dominance plays a part in his submission to me... I believe intelligence does. He knows and can anticipate what I expect and want and carries out actions based on that, not on any sort of "take-chargeness". As for rights, do you not feel you are entitled to anything? Nothing at all? Or, more aptly put, how do you interpret this particular topic or what do you believe in? Do you feel you have any "right" (or, insert another word here) to health and, on a more basic level, to life? If so, what would you call this belief? If not, are you able to expand because I would be extremely interested to know The whole erotic juices thing really annoyed me. I think that is what mainstream society feels or believes that this lifestyle is about... Dominatrix's dressed in leather, cracking a whip at a poor, naked man tied up on the floor... and maybe that gets some people's erotic juices flowing when they're watching porn late at night on the internet... but for me it has nothing, whatsoever, to do with it. We have sex just as vanilla couples would have sex. We have sex as we did before we transitioned naturally into this lifestyle. So I don't think it makes any difference to me. I don't believe you're dense at all when it comes to this concept or the terminology. I think you're pretty spot on. M. Rebekah