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	TSR : Web boards : M/s D/s O&P : "Rape in a M/S relationship?" 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Rape in a M/S relationship? (63) This post is on the M/s D/s O&P web board. 6 Feb 12, 12:53 PM pet_ka_MJ CA, 2 yrs Tanos wrote: As said on a previous thread, I think you can argue this three ways: Sex is never rape in M/s because the slave has consented to sexual use when they agreed to be made a slave. Sex is always rape in M/s because the slave can no longer give meaningful consent, due to the coercive environment that the owner maintains. Sex is sometimes rape, sometimes not in M/s relationships, depending on what the slave feels at the time. On the question of whether owners should insist on sex or even obtain it by force when the slave doesn't feel like it, then I would say that is part of the general rights over the slave's body which an owner has. There are very very few situations in which someone is so ill that sex is going to permanently harm them, and part of being owned is that the ultimate judgements about that are made by owners. Furthermore, I would say that repeated experiences of slaves saying "no, I just can't do it" but then finding that when forced to, yes, actually they can and their owner is right, is very helpful in building and maintaining enslavement. :T: Your second point confirms some research I conducted about the types of criminal charges that were laid when the investigation included an element of BDSM, of the 27 charge files I reviewed over a 3 year period (across Canada), sexual assault was always included as one of the offenses. So while many of us may believe that your first point applies to M/s relationships, the law in Canada takes a completely different view. "We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned, so as to have the life that is waiting for us. The old skin must be shed before a new one can come." ~ Joseph Campbell 6 Feb 12, 3:52 PM ThrallofShades 10 mths Sir_Don wrote: Rape in a M/S relationship? Good day! My slave and I have been thinking about the act of rape in our relationship, and what role, if any, it should have in a M/S household. On one side, a slave gives its body and soul to its Master to take care of, giving him/her the responsibility to take care of it and make sure it is feeling well. But on the other, it is a slaves duty to serve its Master in every way possible, giving him/her its body if he/she desires it. I would appreciate responses from people with their own thoughts on the subject. From Masters, I would like to hear what their thought is about having sexual intercourse with their slaves when they are not willing to do so, and possibly hear about such experiences. From slaves, I would want to hear what you would think if your Master did this to you, both what you would think during, and after. Would you think less of him for abusing his responsibility to take care of you, or think higher of him for upholding his right to use your bodies? With greetings, Sir Don. This slave believes that rape can happen in M/s. If the feelings are still there afterward, yes it is rape. The thing is, in this slave's opinion, are both the Master and the slave willing to discuss the issue and find ways for it to not feel as harmful emotionally for either of them. (Rape can happen to anyone on either side of the slash.) @Tanos: When you mention turning a slave's no into a yes, this slave hopes you are not referring to coercion. To coerce someone into a yes would still be rape. And just because the slave finally has broken down to saying yes it doesn't mean they truly mean it. This is why this slave believes communication afterward is very important. If coercion is involved in internal enslavement, how is it internal? This slave does enjoy rape play and still has times where it reaches a bad place during the experience. These are things my Master wants this slave to talk about so we can build trust. From there this slave is slowly growing internally enslaved to him. Conditioning can be done in a way that doesn't involve coercion . Thrall, the slave of Master Shades13th. His slave, property, pet, adult little girl. Edited 6 Feb 12, 3:54 PM by ThrallofShades 6 Feb 12, 4:47 PM Tanos UK, 14 yrs Y! ThrallofShades wrote: @Tanos: When you mention turning a slave's no into a yes, this slave hopes you are not referring to coercion. When you mention "slave", I hope you are not referring to "girlfriend". :T: www.tanos.org.uk 8 Feb 12, 8:00 PM ThrallofShades 10 mths Tanos wrote: ThrallofShades wrote: @Tanos: When you mention turning a slave's no into a yes, this slave hopes you are not referring to coercion. When you mention "slave", I hope you are not referring to "girlfriend". :T: They can be one and the same. Oh, and don't even think to pretend that real world laws regarding rape have no affect on an M/s relationship. They do. The more you hide behind this idea that coercion is part of an M/s relationship, which is isn't always, and actually contradicts the idea of internal enslavement, you are just continuing to promote rape culture. As someone who has been raped in the past, while not in an M/s relationship at the time, this slave does not see your coercion comments (and the most recent one as well), as nothing more than the same old victim-blaming bullshit. Slaves can be raped. Anyone can be raped. Even a Master like you can potentially be raped. Most rapes are perpetrated by those that the victim trusts. (Look it up if you have to, that is a fact.) And the idea that slaves can't be raped and only "girlfriends" can is backwards. Slaves are people too. They aren't always women or even biologically female. So stop using your apparent straight white male privilege as a reason for you to say that rape doesn't happen in M/s. It does. Whether you choose to believe it does it up to you. It doesn't erase the fact that it does happen. With this, I am flouncing from this site. It's apparent that the owner doesn't give a shit about slaves as people and is just another privileged straight white male who thinks that M/s somehow absolves a Master of perpetrating a crime (regardless of the crime based on his views) this slave would rather find another site where the people are more open-minded instead of just another bunch of bullying assholes with no care for the victims of the crimes they are deeming "okay" for a D-type to do. Fuck that shit. This slave lives in the real world. You can all live in your fantasy land as much as you like. Thrall, the slave of Master Shades13th. His slave, property, pet, adult little girl. 8 Feb 12, 11:55 PM SL_precious CA, 3 yrs @ThrallofShades.... I know you deleted your profile but I'm sure you are looking I'm sorry that you had such a horrible experience but you are missing the point. A Vanilla rape is entirely different from a Master using their slave for sexual purposes, if they are in the mood or not it's what they signed up for. It's no different than the rare occasion when Master whips my ass just because he feels like it. I might not like it but I'm not going to yell abuse because it isn't. I am his slave and will accept what is given to me...in the end I am always thankful. Happy hunting for another site. Perhaps someday you will understand what internal enslavement is. precious "Amazing what happens when we let go, surrender all and embrace the painful changes that are necessary to bring wholeness, and a brighter tomorrow." Suzanne Sondberg 9 Feb 12, 11:17 AM Tanos UK, 14 yrs Y! ThrallofShades wrote: Tanos wrote: ThrallofShades wrote: @Tanos: When you mention turning a slave's no into a yes, this slave hopes you are not referring to coercion. When you mention "slave", I hope you are not referring to "girlfriend". They can be one and the same. The problem with referring to girlfriends who cannot be coerced as "slaves" is that it robs those of us who want to talk about our M/s relationships of the terms with which to do so. you hide behind this idea that coercion is part of an M/s relationship, which is isn't always, and actually contradicts the idea of internal enslavement Coercion is inherently part of internal enslavement and examples of coercion have been used when discussing internal enslavement from the start. So stop using your apparent straight white male privilege as a reason for you to say that rape doesn't happen in M/s. You seem to have missed the bit where I set out three different positions about whether rape can never, must always, or may sometimes happen in M/s, without any judgement about which is the case. I suspect the racism and other bigottry you've just displayed makes it harder for you to read the sentences rather than just react to the words :T: www.tanos.org.uk 10 Feb 12, 12:53 AM SeanT70 9 yrs SL_precious wrote: Happy hunting for another site. Perhaps someday you will understand what internal enslavement is. I'm not gonna hold my breath, if English and grammar are that hard to grasp, then a harder concept and something that creeps in and busts you wide open, and lays you completely barren, isn't gonna be so easily understood. Just to recap my point; y'all did 'read' the story, right? Memo me if ya don't understand what I mean Have fun yo! Sean. 9 Mar 12, 1:30 PM Gragans DK, 2 mths I do believe that my slave are not allow to say no to sexual activities... at any point, place or circumstance. I DO however respect it to happen, but then she should expect me not to be pleased with her service. This way I believe that I do not happen to go over a unsaid hard limit, but also letting my slave know that denying me in my right as owner, will be judged at punished accordingly 11 Mar 12, 9:47 AM flower_421646556 UK, 6 yrs SL_precious wrote: @ThrallofShades.... I know you deleted your profile but I'm sure you are looking I'm sorry that you had such a horrible experience but you are missing the point. A Vanilla rape is entirely different from a Master using their slave for sexual purposes, if they are in the mood or not it's what they signed up for. It's no different than the rare occasion when Master whips my ass just because he feels like it. I might not like it but I'm not going to yell abuse because it isn't. I am his slave and will accept what is given to me...in the end I am always thankful. Happy hunting for another site. Perhaps someday you will understand what internal enslavement is. precious In response to ThrallofShades - I too have been raped in the past by my then boyfriend. There was no M/s involved in that relationship tho he was very domineering, looking back it could have been seen as a kinda M/s thing going on had I known about such relationships then but it was entirely different to the relationship I am in now. I love my Owner/husband and trust him 100%. He owns me and can therefore do as he wishes with me, that includes sex - whenever and however he wants it. He is aware of my past and the difficulties that have arisen in our relationship because of it but I know he would not push things too far until he feels I'm ready (he knows me better than I know myself sometimes). Therefore I don't see how he could rape me in our relationship. As precious stated sometimes she may not like to be whipped - she doesn't turn to her Master and say "not tonight dear" its part and parcel of this dynamic and if you can't understand that you probably shouldn't be in such a relationship to begin with. Berrating others, especially Tanos just shows that you can't take other people's comments as that, merely comments (this has been said a number of times throughout this site). I believe it was Sean that said, if you don't like a post, don't read it..... Just my two penneth worth tho, it can always be ignored 11 Mar 12, 12:37 PM MistressJenn1 CA, 3 mths Y! When both parties enter into the Relationship and all the issues are resolved to both parties satisfaction , then rape is still illegal and should be dealt with through the courts. You can't justify the arguement , "My property so I can do as I see fit....order your submissive to rob a bank...order you submissive to kill....see how far that will go in court as a defense...rape in its most basic form (which it is at any stage of the act) is still a crime as robbing the bank and killing someone...Some things are infact black and white , no grey are here. Next page