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	TSR : Web boards : O&P : "What do I do now?" 1 2 3 What do I do now? (29) This post is on the O&P web board. 9 Jan 10, 5:05 PM Mona_Demarkov HR, 2 yrs subluna wrote: What is missing in your relationship is control of the "outer life". Yeah, it is taken for granted that vanilla people in our lives should not be informed about the dynamic, mostly because it is a private matter, and they wouldn't understand anyway. Which does provide a huge gap in the "two lives" of the sub, and I'm wondering if this can be reduced in some way, as you suggest. I know that when we're surrounded by fetish people often, be it at fetish fairs, munches, events, so basically when others outside of our little inner circle confirm his submission, it is easier for him to keep up a good feeling about it. Also, he just loves being treated as a submissive/serving me in front of other fetishists, again the presence of many people knowing/noticing making a big difference in his head space. I need a horde of people to live with, it seems. 9 Jan 10, 7:51 PM pinklucy UK, 3 yrs Maleficent_Smiles wrote: subluna wrote: What is missing in your relationship is control of the "outer life". Also, he just loves being treated as a submissive/serving me in front of other fetishists, again the presence of many people knowing/noticing making a big difference in his head space. I need a horde of people to live with, it seems. Again I understand this. There is a particular buzz to being around people who know and re-enforce what you are doing. I always looked forward to our monthly fetish club night where we could feel immersed in our dynamic. Similarly, having D/s friends round who recognised and enjoyed our protocols was always fun and exciting. However, this just links back to what I said earlier about moving from the realm of fantasy into the realm of reality. Yes, it is all part of the reality but real life isn't like a fetish holiday. What happened with me was that I began to feel pleasure and excitement from the more everyday mundane things because they reminded me that now this was *real*. I was living the dream! So although going to the hairdressers might be less exciting than serving coffee semi-naked to Mistress's friends, when I thought deeply about how I was only at the hairdressers because I was obeying instructions given by my Mistress about how to keep my hair then I felt a wave of satisfaction which is a different kind of thing but something wonderful. It really is about feeling the satisfaction of submission in the everyday and I think that comes more naturally to some people than others. It's also true that genuine submission involves sometimes doing things that you don't like, and I don't mean 'don't like' in the scene playing sense of 'oh no Mistress please, don't make me!' I mean the more mundane, 'I really wanted to watch that TV programme that's on later but I've been instructed to go to bed early so I'll have to miss it, damn!' variety. I also learned to experience those moments as something simultaneously frustrating and yet wonderfully affirming. It affirmed the reality of who we were and what we were doing. I would say that if your sub genuinely can find no level of satisfaction from day to day submission then a 24/7 dynamic will not suit him. Many people are happier limiting this dynamic to scene time and those times can be incredibly intense and fulfilling. I have questioned myself whether I am actually suited to a 24/7 dynamic and in a general sense I would say I am not, but I found it worked with one person in particular. Perhaps he has a drive to do this with you, but it isn't it natural inclination? 15 Jan 10, 8:55 AM mamabear NL, 2 yrs [/quote] Again I understand this. There is a particular buzz to being around people who know and re-enforce what you are doing. I always looked forward to our monthly fetish club night where we could feel immersed in our dynamic. Similarly, having D/s friends round who recognised and enjoyed our protocols was always fun and exciting. [/quote] One of the reasons I wanted to move to the Netherlands was for this very reason. I lived in Texas and Oklahoma...the bible belt (nothing wrong with that)...and I didn't honestly feel like I could let go of some the things that had be drilled into my head over the years. I wanted to go where there weren't as many outside expectations. Where I could be myself without the ever present fears of what if work or friends found out. While that shouldn't matter, it was still a head issue for me. Getting away from all the outside expectations seems to be helping me to open myself up more...maybe even relaxing me a bit. It's allowing me to immerse myself in the dynamic. Personally I can't wait till we get to go to one of these clubs here. And the best part is I feel so much more free to do so. Amazing what happens when you get out of your comfort zone and explore. 16 Jan 10, 12:44 AM 333-528-841 CA, 3 yrs subluna wrote: Attempt also have contact with someone in his circle of friends or relatives whom you also can interact with and learn about sensitive, but perhaps even innocent, information about him that you can use to make him insecure. Personally, I don't think I could be in a relationship where I was made to feel insecure. My Master likes that I am a self assured, confident (usually, ) woman. Part of being a submissive for some is doing things to the best of your ability whether service or control oriented. You don't have to necessarily enjoy doing things, but focus on the task at hand in order to please your Master/Mistress. 333-528-841 Life shouldn't be measured by the breaths you take; but by the moments that take your breath away 16 Jan 10, 2:08 PM De_Luxe UK, 4 yrs Maleficent_Smiles wrote: subluna wrote: What is missing in your relationship is control of the "outer life". Yeah, it is taken for granted that vanilla people in our lives should not be informed about the dynamic, mostly because it is a private matter, and they wouldn't understand anyway. I concur. Maleficent_Smiles wrote: Which does provide a huge gap in the "two lives" of the sub, and I'm wondering if this can be reduced in some way, as you suggest. I know that when we're surrounded by fetish people often, be it at fetish fairs, munches, events, so basically when others outside of our little inner circle confirm his submission, it is easier for him to keep up a good feeling about it. Our M/s life exists outside the home and fetish circle, it is practised daily yet we are careful about how we do it so that there isn't a negative impact on the vanilla world. Anywhere vanilla where there are lots of people, the busier the better, any one of them could be D/s or M/s. It may pay to remind him when you step outside your door that any one of them could be D/s or M/s and, being attuned to it they will recognise if he is vanilla or a submissive submitting. If he isn't equal in rights the way a vanilla boyfriend is have him walk behind you. I look with D/s eyes so I would spot this but to vanilla people it will just look like he is lagging behind. I'd bring him round to the idea that if he wants to feel good more often when his focus is on you then you can confirm your pleasure of his submission. I second the suggestion that you have him write for you about 'what submission is'. I think you have to know in depth what you own in order to own it in depth if that doesn't sound too cryptic and all arty farty. 19 Jan 10, 2:58 PM Mona_Demarkov HR, 2 yrs Just a little update: After a few long conversations with him I came to the conclusion that he has a fetish for a modifieid Stockholm syndrome relationship. Well, this should be interesting. 19 Jan 10, 3:35 PM mamabear NL, 2 yrs Interesting....indeed. 19 Jan 10, 6:30 PM 333-528-841 CA, 3 yrs That is interesting. From the Wikipedia: Hostages who develop Stockholm syndrome often view the perpetrator as giving life by simply not taking it. In this sense, the captor becomes the person in control of the captive's basic needs for survival and the victim's life itself. [1] The hostage endures isolation from other people and has only the captor's perspective available. Perpetrators routinely keep information about the outside world's response to their actions from captives to keep them totally dependent.[1] Of course there is more in the development on the wiki, but it is interesting. My understanding on the first part is very similar to a M/s dynamic. I personally don't know if the isolation bit practical but if interacation is controlled by the Owner, I suppose it could have a similar result. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome All the best to the two of you on your journey. 333-528-841 Life shouldn't be measured by the breaths you take; but by the moments that take your breath away 19 Jan 10, 11:16 PM Mona_Demarkov HR, 2 yrs It seems like the end result is similar to the M/s dynamic, but the method of getting there is quite different...Now I've got some planning to do...I won't play out a kidnap scene, but I shall have to think of ways to have actual physical control over him for at least a few months...Well, challenges are fun, eh...