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	TSR : Web boards : M/s and D/s : "'turning' a vanilla partner" 'turning' a vanilla partner (9) Wed 17 Jun 09, 12:46 AM Sebastian AU, 2 yrs I thought this deserved a thread - are there others out there who identify themselves as desiring a D/s or even M/s relationship, but are with (and wish to stay with) a partner who is largely vanilla? When I made my previous post: http://www.seekdiscipline.com/posts/177771/0 we were exploring a M/s dynamic, but soon after that everything, to be blunt, went to shit. It seems that all my assumptions were wrong and that she was trying to go along with my attempts at introducing M/s into our lives but really not enjoying it at all. This almost broke up our 11 year relationship, hence me not posting for some time. There was alot of hurt. Fortunately, our marriage was strong enough that we could sort things out and have returned to a fairly stable, fairly vanilla relationship, and I have learned alot of lessons. One is that you can't 'organise' someone into being a submissive or slave, even if they do enjoy some aspects of a D/s dynamic. I can see that from her perspective I was asking her to behave submissively, suggesting rules etc and basically what she was seeing were obligations and expectations that she felt she could never live up to, rather than being able to help shape that aspect of our lifestyle (which was actually my desire). That seems to be the key - if you are the partner who is most into BDSM, especially as a dominant, then it is easy for the other to feel like they can never live up to your fantasies - so there is a negative reinforcement. The easiest thing for them to do is simply not buy into it at all and to just 'go through the motions'. Now I still remain true to my dominance but try not to have expectations of her, and I am finding that the submissiveness she does show is far more genuine now, but of course I would like much more of it and faster, and must be patient and realistic. Anyone had similar experiences?? Seb. 17 Jun 09, 12:29 PM Mistressofmypretty UK, 3 yrs Y! Hello I'm not sure whether this answers your question, but for Me, your question was perfectly timed and so I need to answer. my pretty and I were vanilla, or so I thought. Actually, I didn't even think that, I knew no other way to be. And then years of deceit were disclosed to Me and it evolved that, amongst many, many other things that were shocking to Me at that time, he is a self-confessed masochist and submissive. And so he brought D/s into our relationship and into My life. I was gobsmacked to say the least. In fact, it turned my world upside down and I grieved for the man I thought I knew and loved. I began to research all of the things my pretty had told me about, I spent days, weeks and even months reading about things I'd never even knew existed, and my world changed forever (she said dramatically!) my pretty wanted to submit to Me and so I had a decision to make. It took Me some time to allow him to, but I did, and so now we've been this way for three or so years. It's hard work sometimes, and so often, I've felt as though I was just not cut out for it. During the last few weeks, I have been reviewing our relationship from a D/s perspective as a small number of instances led me to believe that I was paying lip service to our relationship in order to keep my pretty happy. Not so. What has become clear to Me, is that I find our relationship difficult without the D/s dynamic. In a nutshell, I feel like I've lost My place, and I even wonder whether I could survive in a relationship without it. Whilst much of the literature I've read tells Me that those with a submissive nature gravitate to those who are 'naturally' dominant, I've never thought of Myself in this way, but now I wonder. All I do know is that I have been influenced/enlightened to change from a vanilla partner into the one I am now. But I also know that I've done it, or am doing it, on My own terms. And that I think, is the crux of the matter. If I continued in a D/s relationship, just for the sake of the relationship, or my pretty, I'm sure we'd flounder in the future. Moving forward, acknowledging that it is My choice, will make a positive difference. Mistress of my pretty 17 Jun 09, 3:57 PM MasterC4slave US(SC), 15 mths Y! MY partner and I also went through a rough time where I was wanting her to submit to me and trying to make her my sub/slave in a d/s lifestyle. She was vanilla through and through but decided that being vanilla she couldn't keep me completely happy so she "tried" being a sub/slave. She was getting more and more miserable so we stopped. WE figured out that she just could not be comfortable being a sub/slave...Because she NEEDED to be in CONTROL. Now WE have decided to accept a slave into our house and WE are getting along great. Maybe that is what is going on with your partner... Let her try dominating someone. Who knows, maybe she is a domme at heart. MASTER C & MISTRESS S 18 Jun 09, 6:03 PM janwine UK, 14 mths As a slave , way back when, i tried to turn my husband into a Master. It was a total and utter failure. He tied a great knot (eagle scout), bossed me around some, hit me with a paddle in perfect predictable rhythm but he was doing it as a favor to me so of course it didn't work. Through the years I've met quite a few people, (mostly women) who tried to "convert" their husbands. Only one succeeded and he was a latent dominant to begin with. My opinion- either you are wired that way or you are not. 18 Jun 09, 9:47 PM 529-314-296 US(MI), 3 yrs janwine wrote: As a slave , way back when, i tried to turn my husband into a Master. It was a total and utter failure. ..... My opinion- either you are wired that way or you are not. ------------------------- I agree completely. "You are either wired that way or not". There are so many I have thought had the perfect makings of an excellent Master (or an excellent slave for that matter), but one thing was always missing -- the wiring for that lifestyle. There's no forcing this thing on anyone, or even "converting" someone. If you seem to, it's because the seed was there in the first place and all you did was water it or give it some sunshine .... ~ slave bagoas "Slaves, obey your human masters in everything with the reverence, the awe, and the sincerity you owe to Christ." ~ St. Paul (Colossians 3:22) 19 Jun 09, 2:47 AM Ou_pais US, 4 yrs First of all i'm impressed that the two of you were able to get through what sounds like a pretty rough period. Go you! Second, i think one of the things that helped me most in my slavery was that for reasons outside our control we had to go slow. In my opinion, building the slavery one small step at a time gave it a stronger, deeper foundation. It wasn't always easy. Sometimes it was incredibly painful. And it hasn't meant that everything's been perfect all the way along, either. But overall i think it was a net positive. Perhaps going slowly can be positive for you & her as well. The metaphor of the seed seems apt to me. In the correct environment, submission or enslavement can blossom where it might not have seemed obvious before. On the other hand, you can't grow a rose from a tulip bulb, and sometimes you've just got to appreciate the beauty of what you've got. Aw, now i'm getting all poetic. pais 19 Jun 09, 8:10 PM Sklavos_mou_Kyriah UK, 2 yrs I've been married 45 years now and it has definitely been vanilla for most of the time. When we were newlyweds my wife quickly learnt I was into bondage and a sub. She rose to the role as a domme very quickly. She has a naturally dominant nature to start with. I, for my part can be very assertive and self willed but readily take on a submissive role. This all went well until the children came along. Now it must also be remembered that we are talking early 1960s here and we lived in a very rural part of Northumberland where social attitudes were not quite as liberal as in the towns. An M/s partnership, if in the open would have been very much frowned upon. So, when the children arrived, the activity discontinued and we went vanilla. With the passage of time, we never really got back to where we left off. Fast forward to the 21st. century. We are much older and dare I say it, staid. The sex drive is not so potent as it once was, with either of us, my wife is a septugenarian and I'm only a year from becoming one myself. But just over a year ago, a group of us did a historical role-play experiment in Cyprus where some of us became slaves in the ancient Greek context. (I have done historical re-enactment in the past, but not as a slave ) This re-awakened a latent side to me. I felt liberated in the role. The Mistress in this case was a Greek Cypriot friend who sold me on afterwards to my current LM who I have known for some time. She bought me cheap, 20 euros if you please! The money was given to a charity of my choice BTW. This selling on was because some of us wanted to continue. To cut the long story short, I am now owned by LM who lives in East Anglia and I in Lancashire. But LM has me serve my wife as a slave. So by a round-about route I am back in the lifestyle. My wife has me as a slave when she wants me as one, and I get to be with LM from to time. All open and above board to all parties I hasten to add. To be a true slave is to be truly free Slave/Sklavos 28 Jun 09, 2:28 AM Sebastian AU, 2 yrs All this is tied up with the way you 'come of age' as a dom or sub. Some recognise it from an early age, some don't know that anyone else in the world feels the same way, some just realise it one day. The other parts of your life don't necessarily wait until you figure it out. It can be hard to know what part of your kink is something you indulge in for your own entertainment and what is part of your core, something you cannot change. One thing that made it far easier for me after our M/s experiments failed was my wife saying that she didn't want me to change - giving me freedom to be my dominant self. It was what I expected of her that she had a problem with. This gave me room to figure out what 'being myself' actually meant when it came to dominance and to not feel like it was part of me that I had to repress. Forums like this one are wonderful for realising that there is every variety of relationship out there, but it is easy to feel intimidated as well. I am realising that it is important to ultimately forge your own path as a couple. 2 Aug 09, 4:00 PM Miss_charlie_owl UK, 13 mths asking my parntner to do this saved me, my life and my relationship! hello all ill tell you breifly my history and offer a different spin on the question. firstly i am a sub or slave however you may chose to phrase it(still not sure of the difference)- i have shown a likening to the d/s lifestyle and also the m of s/m for the longest of times- i'm only 21 and to be honest although it might be odd to most have been intrested in the ideas (although to start of with did not know what exactly i was intrested in)of d/s since i was about 13/14 and s/m for even longer. although i am quite honestly very very new to the d/s 24/7 lifestyle, and finding it hard to get into cause it is so diversly indervidual that there is no getting started pages or how to's as such, its kinda been clear that all along i have felt the same way. my partner or rather H2B and i have been living for want of a better term a vanilla lifestyle for over 2 years. because of personal problems our sex life and well love life was non existant. suffering with depression and (please dont think badly or that i was conforming to any socialy veiwed standard "lable" as such) i addmitily had been self harming since i was 11. when i met my master everything changed for me - although our life was and in alot of ways still is very vanilla (cause we dont know what we are doing and dont have a mentor)- i felt instantly a need to please him and to do as he asked. i am a very head strong person and although like i said earlyer the ideas of being submissive and having no control have always intreaged me finding my self comfortable enough with some one even in a sexual relation to alow that sort of release of control never happened after an incident in a park when i was 16. i found it hard to trust even though with partners i would tell them i liked to be trated roughly thats as far as i would let it go . anyway when i met my partner it changed he saved my life and when he told me no more harming i stopped and for the most part have not done it since to the point - with a lustless soon to be marrage and my depression, lossing my job and being completly broke the haming thin started to sink in again less then two weeks ago - i was sitting out side contemplating all my options - leaving him- giving into the need to feel phsical pain instaid of the tidal flow of emotions- takeing a break - and every other option although i knew all of them would break his heart. but in the end something had to change - or i would lose him cause i couldn't stay that way. it was then that i found a fan fiction involving BDSM - to be honest i had never heard of it (D/s) being a lifestyle before and i decided that this is the change we needed - A. it was something i had always been intrested in but not really new i could have it all the time and lets face it its not like we were having sex to simply incorperat it on occasion - B. i thought if he felt more in control it might help his problems with intermace and that he might finally feel confident about himself and everything else - hence better comunication and C. well it just seemed so right- when i talked to him about what i wanted and why explaining all the reasons i wanted it and how i thought it would help our relationship he was genuinly willing to consider it - i said to him can we try it for a week see what we can make of it and we will re-evaluate next sunday - well its been a week and I havent been this happy and neither has he in well years. all my reasonings turned out to be true it has helped us in every way i thought it would and in only just a week we feel the same love for each other as we did when we first stared dateing. and we have bearly even started yet - lol like i said not know what we are doing here- but to be honest i dont think there is even the possibility of ever going back to vanilla so i sujest have the same talk i did. be loving and logical about the discution - but structuer it almost like a pitch at a buyers meeting - highlight the up sides explain why they are up sides and how it will benifit your relationship and then offer a free trial- but dont go to hard in that first week or two - ease her into it you cant change who you are and everything about you mentaly over night but you can change also if there is something she likes (for eg bring restrained - me i love the idea of being collared and belonging to him in such a deeper way- then get her to wear then when every you can it can actually feel empowering and like you belong) asking my parntner to do this saved me, my life and my relationship! 2 Aug 09, 4:00 PM Miss_charlie_owl UK, 13 mths asking my parntner to do this saved me, my life and my relationship! hello all ill tell you breifly my history and offer a different spin on the question. firstly i am a sub or slave however you may chose to phrase it(still not sure of the difference)- i have shown a likening to the d/s lifestyle and also the m of s/m for the longest of times- i'm only 21 and to be honest although it might be odd to most have been intrested in the ideas (although to start of with did not know what exactly i was intrested in)of d/s since i was about 13/14 and s/m for even longer. although i am quite honestly very very new to the d/s 24/7 lifestyle, and finding it hard to get into cause it is so diversly indervidual that there is no getting started pages or how to's as such, its kinda been clear that all along i have felt the same way. my partner or rather H2B and i have been living for want of a better term a vanilla lifestyle for over 2 years. because of personal problems our sex life and well love life was non existant. suffering with depression and (please dont think badly or that i was conforming to any socialy veiwed standard "lable" as such) i addmitily had been self harming since i was 11. when i met my master everything changed for me - although our life was and in alot of ways still is very vanilla (cause we dont know what we are doing and dont have a mentor)- i felt instantly a need to please him and to do as he asked. i am a very head strong person and although like i said earlyer the ideas of being submissive and having no control have always intreaged me finding my self comfortable enough with some one even in a sexual relation to alow that sort of release of control never happened after an incident in a park when i was 16. i found it hard to trust even though with partners i would tell them i liked to be trated roughly thats as far as i would let it go . anyway when i met my partner it changed he saved my life and when he told me no more harming i stopped and for the most part have not done it since to the point - with a lustless soon to be marrage and my depression, lossing my job and being completly broke the haming thin started to sink in again less then two weeks ago - i was sitting out side contemplating all my options - leaving him- giving into the need to feel phsical pain instaid of the tidal flow of emotions- takeing a break - and every other option although i knew all of them would break his heart. but in the end something had to change - or i would lose him cause i couldn't stay that way. it was then that i found a fan fiction involving BDSM - to be honest i had never heard of it (D/s) being a lifestyle before and i decided that this is the change we needed - A. it was something i had always been intrested in but not really new i could have it all the time and lets face it its not like we were having sex to simply incorperat it on occasion - B. i thought if he felt more in control it might help his problems with intermace and that he might finally feel confident about himself and everything else - hence better comunication and C. well it just seemed so right- when i talked to him about what i wanted and why explaining all the reasons i wanted it and how i thought it would help our relationship he was genuinly willing to consider it - i said to him can we try it for a week see what we can make of it and we will re-evaluate next sunday - well its been a week and I havent been this happy and neither has he in well years. all my reasonings turned out to be true it has helped us in every way i thought it would and in only just a week we feel the same love for each other as we did when we first stared dateing. and we have bearly even started yet - lol like i said not know what we are doing here- but to be honest i dont think there is even the possibility of ever going back to vanilla so i sujest have the same talk i did. be loving and logical about the discution - but structuer it almost like a pitch at a buyers meeting - highlight the up sides explain why they are up sides and how it will benifit your relationship and then offer a free trial- but dont go to hard in that first week or two - ease her into it you cant change who you are and everything about you mentaly over night but you can change also if there is something she likes (for eg bring restrained - me i love the idea of being collared and belonging to him in such a deeper way- then get her to wear then when every you can it can actually feel empowering and like you belong) asking my parntner to do this saved me, my life and my relationship!