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	TSR : Web boards : M/s D/s O&P : "Conflicting desires" 1 2 Conflicting desires (18) This post is on the M/s D/s O&P web board. 4 Jul 09, 4:31 AM tigermonkey US(MN), 2 yrs Deep4menow wrote: Thanks you for your reply! I try to take her cycle into account as much as possible. The real issue is that she just doesn't seem to enjoy masturbation at all I'm hoping to correct that through having her explore different techniques since she has never done it before and really knows nothing about pleasing herself. she also claims that self stimulation of her nipples has no effect at all on her. Really what I suppose I am driving at as far as this post goes is that she gets into these moments of anger and is disobedient and I feel as if pushing may cause her to want to break off this "experiment". what confuses me is this would seem to indicate that she is no interested in being a slave full time and sh has said in those moments that she resents being told what to do, but I know she is really turned on by it and she has told me so when she is calm. I have even explained to her in great detail what is to be expected of her once her training is complete, intentionally using terms and a tone that was meant to get her to quit if she wasn't interested and she accepted it all only saying that she was unsure if she could handle her temper/ if she could enjoy being told what to do constantly. I also like the suggestion to let her know how valuable she is to me because I do that all the time just not from the "possession" aspect so perhaps I should introduce that concept to get her thinking of herself more as my possession? I also thought I might add the restrictions that she must ask my permission to organize social events if they include more than one other person or to spend money over 30$ as she is my property and her time/ what she may earn with it is also mine to distribute how I will. So to boil my question down to a sentence I guess I would ask...is this a normal problem encountered in training a slave new to this sort of thing ( and really to any kind of non missionary type sex)? Also is it something that can be adjusted with training,and if so do you have any suggestions on punishments or training strategies that may be effective without pushing her into total rejection of the lifestyle? Thanks! I know I am asking alot and I appreciate the input. Okay as for my comment on your posts, even Dom/Masters need help, do not give into those who say we don't, there is a learning curve and even we have to expect to have questions and need someone to answer our questions. Its silly to think we are expect to be perfect right out of the gate or ever for that matter. Now on to the second post you made. Forced Masturbation: In this instance I will use my sub as an example. If I forced her to masturbate it would get me about as far as it is you. Maybe your getting farther, but the point is this, by forcing her to do it, you may not ever get her to enjoy it, in someways it seems like you should use it as a punishment. As a side not from a females point of view, making her play with her own nipples is like making her tickle herself it wont work. The word Possession: Have you asked her how she feels about this word. Due to the fact she is new and so are you, she might need worked into that whole perspective on life. Anger/ Disobedience: This is something you need to know is part of her personality and being you are just beginning of the training. Calm her down when she gets angry and let her know that it disappoints you when she yells. The disappointment is a form of punishment in itself. If her goal is to please you, disappointing you will crush her. Disobedience well your punishments will have to be your own, I'm sorry to say. What works for me may not work for you. For example I can tell my girl that I will not talk to her and she is to stay in the room till I tell her she can leave. It is hard on her, very hard on her and for her this is an extreme punishment. So what works for you may be different. Hope this is helpful. 4 Jul 09, 5:06 AM 688-914-375 US(MN), 2 yrs Just a few things I can add to that. I understand the temper, as I too have fits of temper, sometimes I don't even have a clue where they have come from I just respond. There is also something to the fact of liking to be forced. Sometimes, in my experience, (shhhh don't tell my Syr, lol) I do that from time to time. Just to get her to respond and react. It is possible that she does the same thing. Especially while just starting out, it can be a hard thing not to do, as it works so beautifully and if she likes what happens when you punish her, well that is just going to get her to do so even more. Just a few things we have gone through, hope they give you a bit of insight. Something else that I would maybe suggest is that she does some research regularly about the lifestyle, to see what parts you maybe both agree with and disagree with. I have created a project for my Syr, a OneNote notebook that has many things in it that we have found that we like, things we don't like and how-to's. Things like different knots and other such that can be handy to have as reference materials. By doing regular research and familiarizing herself with things, she may find herself much more comfortable, and by creating something for you both to use, feel useful with the finding of the information. Syr's respected and loved little one. My Syr reads all, *grins* no worries she truly knows my nature and knows I have done these things. 4 Jul 09, 10:38 PM masters_little_toy UK, 6 yrs I have to add to this.I never ever masturbated in my 20 years of marriage, and now that I am in a 24/7 D/s i still don't. On top of that for as long as I was married I never had an orgasm, I even began to think they were a myth. Since being with my new partner and Dom, I have learnt that I can orgasm, but I have now will as to when or how long or even how to stop it, it happens of it's own accord and I have absolutly no control. I have been asked to masturbate, but derive no pleasure from the act, if anything it makes me feel very self conscious, and as hard as I try I can't even get turned on, it's a different story when Master does it, I do get turned on and nearly always orgasm.Nippleare no go area for self play, no joy, not even a smirk.The only time I enjoy nipples being played with is during a session, Master knows what to look for and NEVER starts by playing with them,always waits till I hit that zone. I know why I have difficulty, its from my ex relationship. He was useless in bed and had no idea of what made me tick, just constantly nagged me to orgasm and enjoy it.Which made me want to have nothing to do with that at all. I now have flashbacks if I feel I am expected to orgasm on demand which puts me in a negative head space and makes relaxing impossible. Not all women enjoy masturbation or nipple play, your sub may have her own hang ups to do with that area. My advice would be for you to do the masturbation, and at some point when she feels ok and turned on, to take over for a short while, whilst you get a toy etc, then go back and finish the job, this will allow her to do something for you, but she will also hopefully have the orgasm to reinforce that it was a pleasurable thing, and may do it for longer periods in the future. It worked for us. 5 Jul 09, 4:08 AM 333-528-841 CA, 3 yrs It sounds like a bit of reactance on your subs part. That can be a good thing. Have you read any of Tanos essays and articles on IE? They may help to explain some of the reactions. All the best to you both. 333-528-841 5 Jul 09, 2:29 PM masters_little_toy UK, 6 yrs I found them very interesting, they helped me understand a lot about my own reactions. 5 Jul 09, 4:51 PM The_Captain1974 2 yrs Hmmmmmm. "stubborn", "angry", etc These are normal feelings. It is rare that any sub simply "drops into role" and stays there. Again, it is all normal. I absolutely agree with statements (here and other posts)regarding caring for her, cherishing her and her role, showing her that you are proud of her progress and that you, personally you, take pride in having such a woman as her for your slave/sub. Honestly, I find that "honey does attract the fly". In each act performed well give her pride, in each point of submission to your will, give her the knowledge that she is yours because you truly want her. Of course, there is the issue of honesty - you must mean it! A word that does have meaning - "cherish" Cherish her for what she is, absolutely yours! A woman, slave or sub, who believes she is cherished, will do virtually anything for her Master. Remember, cherishing her is not a role or an act, it must be real. Falsehood will get you nothing except a hole. Truth will give you a woman to enjoy, who will love you with her very soul, who will willingly give you every part of her body to use, and who will trust you with her life. You must be "her man" and her Master. 6 Jul 09, 1:40 AM Ou_pais US, 5 yrs Deep4menow wrote: she also claims that self stimulation of her nipples has no effect at all on her. Maybe it's not just a "claim"? For me, playing with my own nipples is kind of like tickling myself, even though they're super-sensitive. Just doesn't do it for me. Also, i'm glad you say you're having her try different techniques--are you having her use toys too? Personally, i recommend the Hitachi Magic Wand. (It might be a little bit of overkill though if she's not used to vibrators.) Also, it can be hard for me to enjoy something if i'm feeling a lot of pressure and i'm worried that i might "fail." Her mileage may vary, of course, but maybe just trying to have fun together could help her relax and enjoy all sexual activities more? Her other reactions do sound like they might be reactance. Punishment is an option of course but not necessarily the only one. Simply maintaining a standard that she can buck against and, as you maintain it, can become familiar and comforting to her, might work as well. Good luck! pais 6 Jul 09, 3:23 AM Johnnypa US(PA), 3 yrs try crossing your arms so it is right fingers on left nipple, left fingers on right nipple. --Jackie