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	TSR : Web boards : M/s D/s O&P : "How to make rules?" How to make rules? (10) This post is on the M/s D/s O&P web board. Thu 14 Feb 08, 4:48 PM 887-458-885 US(IL), 5 yrs Most of you I do not know particularly well, so I will try to make this as blunt as possible without going into the details (which would take up several pages, I am sure)... I have been into M/s for over a year now, with several one time scenes and a Mistress who lasted for three months. That relationship, however was over a year an a half ago. I have been with my current Master for a year (as of yesterday) but up until somewhere between last month and this month, it was relatively vanilla. We had both explored pain, but never submission. He has never been in an M/s relationship, though he is very eager to try and has many naturally dominant tendencies. Now that that's all out of the way, here's my question: How do I help him learn what it is that makes a good dominant, and help him make rules for me without topping from the bottom? I am very lost on this issue, because i've never had an M/s relationship with someone who has not had one before. I gave him a book, and I'm planning on lending him some of my novels; but I'm still having a hard time deciphering what I should do so that he has a clear understanding of what being a Master means without it delving into the realm of fantasy. Also, as a note, I am mostly a kink submissive rather than a lifestyler, but I do not have any objections to participating in lifestyle other than my lack of experience. 14 Feb 08, 5:31 PM subsfaith UK, 6 yrs 887-458-885 wrote: How to make rules? How do I help him learn what it is that makes a good dominant, and help him make rules for me without topping from the bottom? Welcome dear friend. It is a difficult question you pose but quite achievable. The main way of help I would think is to be submissive. It might be an idea to have a frank discussion of where you both would like this to take you. Of course as Master he is under no obligation to you and your ideas, however, you are to him. You say you don't wish to delve into fantasy, but right now that is exactly what you are doing. This lifestyle is a fantasy for you and you are attempting to make it real. Topping from the bottom is quite easy to avoid, don't brat out when you are asked to do something that challenges you, don't strop if he isn't doing something you think he should be doing. Helping him with his dominance is a very different situation from design-you-own-dom. Suggesting reading material is a great idea, that allows him to become more informed, and may well shape who he becomes. However, please bear in mind the adage, be careful what you wish for. Good luck, Faith :: smiles :: 14 Feb 08, 7:50 PM Outlaw US(OK), 4 yrs Suggest to your Master to seek advice from others here on TSR. Not just one or two but several as we are people and we have different veiws on different topics. This can also help keep you out of the "topping from the bottom" loop. Be Careful Out There, Outlaw When online is more stressful than real time.....Y/you have a problem. 14 Feb 08, 8:32 PM masterfiremaam US(WV), 5 yrs There's a lot of goof resources here. First, as another suggested, have him come and ask questions. Second, there are really good books on the subject. Here's TSR's list: http://www.slaveregister.com/listings/books Here's my list (some are more for you and many are repeats): http://www.amazon.com/Ms-Relationship-Books/lm/R... There are national conferences: http://www.slaveregister.com/listings/events There is a international organization called MAsT (found at the bottom of the list of conferences). Check to see if there's a chapter near you. Also, there's a lot of us that have journals or blogs. Most of the titles don't indicate which side of the slash we're on, so you just hafta search...and be aware that most of us lock our LJ posts about the lifestyle. http://www.slaveregister.com/weblogs/ Master Fire LJ Title - "because you can't be ugly" "Be excellent to each other." - Bill and Ted *air guitar* 14 Feb 08, 10:41 PM luna_lux US, 4 yrs Y! you might want to try negotiating a contract. it's a good way of talking about how to set up the dynamic and agreed-upon rules, and a neutral way for you to suggest any, as well. there are a ton of sample contracts on the internet with all sorts of rules and protocols. of course, be careful what you wish for. 16 Feb 08, 8:57 AM Domaster US, 4 yrs a contract is always good. I got set of rules from my ex school mate from Michigan 16 Feb 08, 5:33 PM thekittenpup 4 yrs pet thinks all of these suggestions have been good ones. pet's one major suggestion would be to take it slowly. Just as any good Dom/me would just throw a brand new slave a full schedule of tasks, rules, etc on the first say, a good sub should not expect his/her Dom/me to be able to slide into any kind of role immediately. Probably the most important thing would be to either negotiate a contract, as luna lux suggested, and to have a good discussion about what you both want from the relationship, as pet believe's it was subsfaith suggested. Most of all be honest, both to yourself and your M-type at all times about all things. *curled up at her Master's feet* ~~~~ Master reads and pre-approves every post this pet makes. He will deny and/or completely remove and and all posting rights as He sees fit. ~~~~ 17 Feb 08, 9:27 AM 196-923-708 CA, 4 yrs We're in a similar situation, trying to evolve an existing loving, long-term relationship into a lifestyle one. We've had one false start and are trying again. The category it will eventually fit into (D/s, M/s) is not possible to predict for certain yet. The trick seems to be to take however much time it takes to allow the dynamic to find its own equilibirum at each point. It's fascinating to see it start to work sometimes, then slip into old habits at others. Avoiding topping from the bottom requires care. I look forward to really being under Her control increasingly often. Reading on line is useful, but that only goes so far. The hard, slow work clearly isn't avoidable. Meanwhile the depth of honest communication that's proving necessary is wonderful. For myself as a male sub it fosters a self-awareness and sense of emotional exposure that was previously too scary. Somebody please wish us luck. For 887-458-885 too. 18 Feb 08, 5:16 PM 000-671-955 CA, 7 yrs Y! i tend to agree with with what has been written, Master used some of the 128 Basic Rules that are out there now, and modified some of them for His own use. He understood what i was capable of, and what He had planned for me in the years to come. There were some rules that He stated were "Etched in Stone", and these were to never be changed, and to followed to the letter. Other rules he laid out were ones that would enhance Our Lifestyle, as well as our daily lives within the public, work, and family. He did discuss these rules with me, and asked if i was able to abide by them with committment. There were not many rules, as the 128 Basic ones that are posted many places, but enough that my slavery would fulfill Master's needs, and push my limits in the time to come. He adds rules as time goes on, but after doing this as a daily routine, i find that they are not actually rules, but a way of doing things on a regualr basis. This way Master moves me up to the next level of my training. Master's "o" 671955 18 Feb 08, 6:56 PM Michael_X UK, 6 yrs 887-458-885 wrote: How do I help him learn what it is that makes a good dominant, and help him make rules for me without topping from the bottom? Hi, It is a sad and amusing fallacy that making rules is all about the slave. He needs to know what he wants and what he doesn't want. Then he can produce rules that deal with what he considers important. If he makes rules about things that actually matter to him then it is more likely that he will put the effort in to enforce them. With time he can expand, refine, prune. Lack of clarity is a mistake. Too many is a mistake. Too fast or too slow is a mistake. Failure to enforce is a serious mistake. Making 128 slave rules that get him hard and you wet is a mistake. Knowing what can be controlled directly or indirectly with rules and what requires other approaches comes with time. Having said that, the above is from a dominant perspective. Since this is an M/s board one has to consider that the process of enslavement may require significant additional work in the rules arena. Others here are better qualified than I to expand on that. Given his starting point I'd say guide from the bottom with all your might, add lots of feedback, take regular scheduled time out for you both to discuss what is working and what is not and most of all have fun and don't worry if it is politically correct D/s or M/s or even if some call it WAS. Remember most of those people slapping ass are doing it because they find it hot, it's fun and it works for them. Michael Edited to correct typo Edited 18 Feb 08, 8:29 PM by Michael_X 19 Feb 08, 3:10 AM Ou_pais US, 5 yrs 887-458-885 wrote: How to make rules? Most of you I do not know particularly well, so I will try to make this as blunt as possible without going into the details (which would take up several pages, I am sure)... I have been into M/s for over a year now, with several one time scenes and a Mistress who lasted for three months. That relationship, however was over a year an a half ago. I have been with my current Master for a year (as of yesterday) but up until somewhere between last month and this month, it was relatively vanilla. We had both explored pain, but never submission. He has never been in an M/s relationship, though he is very eager to try and has many naturally dominant tendencies. Now that that's all out of the way, here's my question: How do I help him learn what it is that makes a good dominant, and help him make rules for me without topping from the bottom? I am very lost on this issue, because i've never had an M/s relationship with someone who has not had one before. I gave him a book, and I'm planning on lending him some of my novels; but I'm still having a hard time deciphering what I should do so that he has a clear understanding of what being a Master means without it delving into the realm of fantasy. Also, as a note, I am mostly a kink submissive rather than a lifestyler, but I do not have any objections to participating in lifestyle other than my lack of experience. Maybe try asking him what he likes. When you do something for him, ask him if he likes it that way or if he'd prefer you did it a different way. Try to remember it all. Why does he want you to belong to him? What's his big picture and what are the details that are going to get you there? Personally, i think starting with a few and building up is better. If the master jumps in with a lot of rules they think sound cool but don't actually have the energy or attention span to police, it's hard to stay consistent. As the first rules become second nature, more can always be added. pais