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	TSR : Web boards : Internal Enslavement : "Absolute Honesty" 1 2 Absolute Honesty (18) This post is on the Internal Enslavement web board. 31 Jan 08, 3:26 PM luna_lux US, 4 yrs Y! 139-715-032 wrote: My master expects complete radical honesty from me and absolutely no right to privacy. Anything I think he'd be interested in knowing, or that I'd rather him not know, I'm obligated to tell him. yeah, me too. i am obligated to my dominant to be truthful at all times, and have no expectation of privacy, especially about issues i feel myself wanting to hide in some way. that being said, though, i'm an inculcated member of the cult of truth, inside and outside of D/s. i've learned that there are easier and harder ways to express truth, too. white lies? what's the point? they don't smooth over any cracks as far as i'm concerned, they only break things further. death by a thousand paper cuts and all that. 31 Jan 08, 4:06 PM darlenemarie1965 US(OK), 4 yrs "TRUST" that is what's so dang " AWESOME" about being a slave , its total honesty . its total TRUST. If Master feels he has to say something regardless if its going to hurt my feelings or not . than there is a reason its being said/ addressed. A Master/slave relationship should take the good with the bad . there is always room for improvement . and it makes life so much more interesting .. . ITS A WAY OF LIFE . ITS THE ONLY WAY OF LIFE . if i do say so myself . 587-663-411. 31 Jan 08, 4:47 PM Jezebel_the_Mouse US, 4 yrs ravenkaldera wrote: 139-715-032 wrote: He's promised to be entirely honest with me in all matters, and that if he wants privacy regarding a certain issue, he'll say that plainly. I really like this. It makes it so much easier for me to have an emotionally intimate relationship with him. And having this known about one's slave makes things easier, because you can say, "So I know that you love it when I'm honest, and you'd hate knowing that I was holding back something because I was afraid of your reaction. So I'm going to say something to you now that is probably going to hurt, the sort of thing that the sensitive types would probably get all bent out of shape over and wish I'd lied about. But you're not like that, so I can give you the privilege of the full extent of my thoughts, even ones I wouldn't say to other people. You can be that for me in a way that they can't." -Raven Kaldera This is what I have with E, and I love it, as I love him. Being told something, no matter how hurtful it may seem at the time, is far easier than not knowing and speculating, creating this giant monster of a thing in one's own mind. The truth is freeing as it is binding. I have an extremely curious nature. I often ask things that many individuals might not dare to as it is socially unacceptable; I push the boundaries around me. With E, I'm not worried about that. If there is something he doesn't want me to know, he tells me that, plainly so. This makes me stop asking, and if at a later date he wants to, he will tell me; I will then be privileged to know what others may never even guess at in his life. The truth, and nothing but the truth is more of a figment in the lives I see around me. There are all of these little white candy coated "truths" abound. It makes my stomach churn. Lies piled upon lies create a web to be sorted through and categorized. What did I tell who? When? Or was it that other time, then? I can lie. I can lie extremely well. I can look you in the eye and say whatever poison 'it' is spouting from my lips without glancing away. I can stare you down if need be in a contest of wills... but I do not like to do this. I love to be honest, not necessarily carefree, but kind and tactful where I can be in the unpleasantness of pleasant truth. I lied to E once, and it tore me apart. He didn't know I had lied, but I called him and told him what I did. He was across the continent at that time. We are working through it over time. I have not lied since, nor will I. Lying to him hurt more than I thought imaginable from a lie... you see I used to be a chronic liar, years ago. That is why I am so good at it, and why I don't like to do it. To the general population around me, I am as honest as I may be, even when it not what they want to hear. I think in living our lives as we have chosen, honesty is one of those fine keys that are entirely necessary for this kind of a relationship, no matter how we choose or end up defining it. So hears to the truth, may it be abound! Hurrah, hurrah, hurrah! 31 Jan 08, 4:57 PM 734-088-777 UK, 4 yrs Total honesty is the only way i can see any Master/slave relationship working, and if we are honest about it, any marriage working either. How else can a relationship such as marriage last or develope into something as much more intimate without 100% truth and honesty? And in my view, there is no way a Master/slave relationship could ever work sucessfully without 100% honesty and commitment. Even before i became my husband's slave, i had always told Him the truth and He has always agreed to tell me the truth no matter how much it could hurt and that has included some very difficult truths about my past (including child/sexual abuse) which through Him knowing about He has helped me get over. If i had kept that from Him, neither O/our marriage nor O/our M/s relationship could ever have survived, nor i ever have come to terms with the abuse i sufferred and learnt to enjoy sex. 31 Jan 08, 5:28 PM little_linnet US, 6 yrs Jezebel_the_Mouse wrote: Being told something, no matter how hurtful it may seem at the time, is far easier than not knowing and speculating, creating this giant monster of a thing in one's own mind. Oh, yes. Not to mention, if he tells me, that means he'll fix me. If he were to tell white lies about something that was bothering him, that would mean it wouldn't get fixed. How long before the things he didn't like, or their degree, reached critical mass and ending the relationship would be easier for him than more white lies? I MUCH prefer knowing there's no fault that can't be addressed and therefore fixed, so I can always be what he wants and so he always wants to keep me. Krista It's just a part of the utterly pretentious way things work in some people's minds. They think they are from the "old way" or whatever, that BDSM is more elevated and literary and classical than plain sex. 31 Jan 08, 10:35 PM deb0rah UK, 10 yrs I also feel though that while we can often think we are being honest and open, unless we have really got to know ourselves it is often harder then it sounds. By that I mean, often lots of human beings lie to themselves or convince themselves that x is the answer needed yet x may not be totally true to the core. I also think that over time we change so much it's important to catch up with yourself at times and ask questions of yourself and see how you feel about anything compared to way back then. It's then a different process to admit to or accept change and to inform him of that change. Honesty is a core need within Ms and I too have often found Ms relationships are more true to that need. I also feel that within the course of a good Ms relationship you become a true extension of another beings will and ideals. Within that, your honesty is quite obvious and different to guessing that answer or need that was often a mistake when you first started, or thinking you know what it is. It's a journey and a path travelled with bumps and grazes. I struggle with anyone claiming it has always been easy or perfect after years of being together. People change over time, their reactions, their knowledge etc. This has an affect on anyone and even within Ms, so needs re visiting to re discover how we tick sometimes too. Something that is often forgotten! I have rambled and will probably re read this thinking what the hell did I mean, but never mind! Debs xx "Woman in her greatest perfection was made to serve and obey man." John Knox 1 Feb 08, 1:07 AM 000-380-949 UK, 12 yrs Rogers_Deb0rah wrote: I also think that over time we change so much it's important to catch up with yourself at times and ask questions of yourself and see how you feel about anything compared to way back then. It's then a different process to admit to or accept change and to inform him of that change. Debs xx That's the kind of situation I had in my own mind when I wrote my reply, where I referred to in depth answers. Those are the hardest sometimes because first responses can change as you say. The initial response is the truth as I know it at that time, then I tend to really analyse myself with certain things and sometimes deep down knowingly or unknowingly haven't been honest with ~myself~ (barriers and own fears) that I then have to face immediately (which I really may not want to) to be able to open up about it with him (which I absolutely do want to). It's not a lie, the barrier makes it not exist almost, until you're directly faced with it and realisation kicks in. When I'm faced with it I have to answer it, I'll answer it and as honestly as I can, then analyse it myself if I know I've not been honest with myself, then go back and tell the whole truth, explaining exactly what led to those depths in thinking and what I've thought about since. Facing it yourself is bad enough, then there's the fear of coming out and being honest about it which then may actually set wheels in motion to making it happen inadvertantly (ergo being honest to my own detriment, after all, he is a sadist and does like mind fucking ) and what might seem like a jumbled mess to me is actually very easy to read and clear to him. It's hard, but it is something I have learned to do, because as I've learned to know myself, I've wanted him to know everything there is to know about me, too, sometimes fearing bad results, but that have always been good ones in the long run. The in depth knowledge he has then gives him complete control over what happens next, if anything, when and how, under his guidance, which to date, his chosen routes have always been the exact right ones to take for the very right end results that have followed. I just couldn't imagine being any other way with him, he knows as much about me now as I know about myself at any one given moment and the growth and expansion that comes from that have only ever had very positive end results, even if the track getting to that finishing line has been a difficult one to run along. I hope that made sense and didn't just sound like a bunch of waffle. I've been as honest and open on this here as I am with him privately as it might help understand posts I write a little more and the angle they're coming from. tracie..x Edit: I've said it before and I'll say it again, I just love my signature quote. It always seems to sum up every single thing I write. “Nothing is ever the same as they said it was. It's what I've never seen before that I recognise.” Diane Arbus. Edited 1 Feb 08, 1:33 AM by 000-380-949 2 Feb 08, 5:27 PM Yarakot 6 yrs isouda wrote: what surprises me though is she idea that being confident enough to desire and need honesty has no self esteem, whilst needing lies to make one feel good is a good thing!!! I guess her insecurity caused her reaction. It surprised me as well and I very nearly said something like, "Oh yeah? Well I think people who can't handle truth clearly have less self-esteem!" But I caught myself, telling myself that I am not a fifth-grader and further I am owned by my beloved who has a standard of conduct for me that does not include childish slanging matches in the workplace. It was in that pause where I tried to think of something to say that sounded urbane and non-childish when she told me to go away. However, she seemed much happier with me yesterday, so I am assuming that all is well again and my slavish devotion to truth has been forgiven. After I walked away from her, I continued the conversation in my mind (I do this) and discussed the nature of self-esteem and truth. Unfortunately, it appears that I am better at debating with myself than she is at debating with me. What I realized in my personal debate is that self-esteem plays no part in whether or not I want truth. I want truth because I can't tell when I am lied to and therefore don't trust people who have a history of lying to me. I have no other defense against being taken or conned or harmed other than seeking out people who are equally committed to truth. I encourage unpleasant truths so that I can trust the pleasant ones. If my owner lies about how I look in a dress, can I trust him when he says he loves me? My intuition is that I can't. That's not precisely self-esteem. I suspect that a person with a strong sense of self-esteem would not need the protection that truth provides nor would she need pleasant lies to retain her good feelings about herself. So perhaps self-esteem lies completely outside the realm of truth. Truth has its own majesty, beauty, and pragmatic benefit that doesn't depend on self-esteem and self-esteem is likewise separate. Elsewhere, Raven refers to being broken. I suspect that we can each be broken in our own unique ways. I am perhaps broken in my lie-sensing apparatus, which leads me to favor truth. She is perhaps broken in her ability to withstand unhappy truths, which leads her to her defenses. That said, I still think that absolute honesty is crucial for an M/s relationship to survive because of how lies and truth interact to create or destroy power. Carolyn "Each moment opens like a flower. The age of miracles comes every hour on the hour. Turn any corner, there's something new and nothing is too wonderful to be true." -- Launer, Shapiro, & Henning Edited 2 Feb 08, 5:29 PM by Yarakot